The Kent History Forum
Travel and Transport => Roads, Tracks and Paths => Topic started by: Smiffy on June 01, 2020, 11:11:53 PM
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Thought I'd start this off with a picture that I believe shows the Sewing machine shop discussed in the Dudley Studios thread.
Pretty sure I can see "CCB". Taken in the early '60s so if it's only just closed it must have been there quite some time.
(https://i.postimg.cc/zGQkZzB0/St-Margarets-Banks-01.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)
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Yes the sewing shop was there a long time. The last time I passed on a bus ( mid March ) it was closed then. I think had for sale signs in the window but could well be wrong. But I have seen it open this year. I also seem to remember that they serviced my sewing machine back in the 80s. It's now very redundant and reclining in a cupboard :P .
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Nice picture Smiffy...
Have a picture at the far end of the Banks......1885
After the 1960`s Parlour No. 346... I only ever once or twice went here in the early sixties but us scooter lads all congregated outside the Wimpy at the end of Globe Lane.
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At No. 340....The Hare & Hounds Pub...My Dad and Stepmum had there Wedding Reception here on March 11th 1961 after getting married up at St Justus Church up the Tideway. The one that got blown down in the 1987 storm.
Picture is from a Pub Card i still have.
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View along the Banks to the Railway Bridge...where the railings jut inwards are steps that went down to Men Toilets, i remember the steps being chunky and steep.
Lyn`s fish & chip shop is along this part No. 332 Henries Fish Restaurant.
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KeithG - I definitely remember lots of scooters parked outside of the Parlour. Henri's did some of the best chips, always went there for them when I was at college. Are you sure about the toilets, I can't remember any being there?
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I think it was mainly the posh mods went to the Parlour we used to rough it out in the Wimpy ;)
Yes there were toilets 100% sure as i don`t like them and always try to avoid going in them but i was bursting and had to so i do remember first hand ;D ;D
I think there were about three large window slots in the wall...if you get a good picture you can just work out where the brickwork was repaired?
Just had a look on Google Maps and there are now two sets of steps but they are too close together which suggests the second set of steps was just a Toilet?
The first set the road is too low for a toilet.
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I must have been a posh mod then! spent hours in the Parlour. I don't remember any toilets there at all but glad to see the name of the fish and chip shop and my lovely Parlour too of course.
I did have a very red face in there though, tripped up the stairs to the loo and went out the door that was by the side road. Took ages before I ventured in there again 8) . All those scooters parked outside though, lovely memories.
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I knew you would like that Lyn as i remember your posts from the other side ;D
The loos were only stand ups for men.
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Thanks Keith that's all I've got now ... memories . And I do remember from the old forum, there was even a pic of your scooter I think outside the Wimpey.
The good old days without too much responsibility , just rescued a poor Bumblebee from my carpet and gave it sugar water, now flown off on it's merry gatherings. Now all I got to worry about is if I've got to buy a new washing machine !!
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Memory fascinates me, how quirky it can be. On the old forum a few years ago in "Guess the place", a member posted a photo of the double wooden doors, as seen in the brick wall. We emigrated to Australia from Rochester in 1980 and had not seen those doors since then, as a 24 years old. So after some 35 years they were instantly recognisable to me, just a set of wooden doors in a brick wall! I am sure that I would not recognise any other door from that time, for example even my own front door. I also seem to recall that some members posted about what was behind those doors.
Good to see that they are still there
https://www.google.com/maps/@51.3839428,0.5119508,3a,68.4y,219.25h,89.09t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1so8gBI6eHvHTkC9LK2rjBPw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
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Yes I can confirm the presence of the men's loo on St Margrets banks ,if you ever used them the smell will always be remembered ,
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Yes Colin ...it was dreadful down there but needs be.
The stand ups faced the outer wall with the small slits for ventilation and you had to be careful when watching the traffic go by ;D
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For us kids from Troy Town and Star Hill area if you couldn't find your mates up Jacksons or around Blue Boar they would be sheltering from the rain at the Gaumont or Empire entrances. Nice weather and for some reason they could be found hanging around one of local police call boxes outside the Morden Arms, Star Hill; or in this case along the Banks. No idea why; although I suppose in those days if you hung around outside the shops you would get a kick up the backside by the owner and told to shove off.
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Funny you mention the Gaumont/Odeon as both my friend and I found it worth carting our Guy for Guy Fawkes night all the way down Frindsbury Hill and over the bridge to Star Hill just to collect more money from the cinema goers...
By the time we got him back home he was falling to bits with paper and stuffing hanging out everywhere.... great times
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Didn't "The Mindreader " leave his mark on that wall and the one opposite (ish) by the rail bridge?
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Shoot999,interesting shot of the police box on the Banks?cant recall it,but there was its twin opposite the Vineyard pub,corner of Maidstone road -east row just by the strand bus stop.
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Can't recall the Mindbender Pete.... There was another Police Call Box at Star Hill and North Gate traffic lights.
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I definitely remember the old police telephone post from the days before personal radios were standard issue. I wonder what happened to it - probably a feature in someones back garden.
"BAN THE MIND READER" - there's another blast from the past which could probably fill its own thread.
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Funny you mention the Gaumont/Odeon as both my friend and I found it worth carting our Guy for Guy Fawkes night all the way down Frindsbury Hill and over the bridge to Star Hill just to collect more money from the cinema goers...
By the time we got him back home he was falling to bits with paper and stuffing hanging out everywhere.... great times
It was also our favourite spot for guy and general begging in the mid 50s to early 60s. We had the spot on the cinema steps nearest Star Hill and I believe it was the Lamb brothers who had the steps on the other side. We used to ask people too change one penny to half pennies and vice versa. Always made enough for a bag of chips or Andys Snacks. On a good day enough for a film as well. One went in the front entrance, with the rest of us waiting up the alley to be let in at the side. Looking back it was obvious the staff knew what was going on, but just turned a blind eye. Good people. :)
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Can't recall the Mindbender Pete.... There was another Police Call Box at Star Hill and North Gate traffic lights.
Memory fail, Mind reader of course, about 1965? I remember the police box
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Can't recall the Mindbender Pete.... There was another Police Call Box at Star Hill and North Gate traffic lights.
Memory fail, Mind reader of course, about 1965? I remember the police box
Just been reading and Police phone box was there in 1962
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Purchased the 1925 Kelly`s and so many name changes to property even since 1953 / 1965 so according to which year one looks at assume the owners name correct.
In 1925 the end of The Banks nearest Chatham border in 1925 was No 346 Robinson Cabinet Maker then a Wesleyan Church, which i can`t find a picture of.
Picture shows No 344 Bishops and Son Upholsterers also at No 338 with No 342 RSPCA in 1953 it was Mrs Vincent Confectioner in 1925.
Hare & Hounds Pub at No 340 you can just see the Style & Winch sign.
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Just had a flashback :o Cannot find pictures of the shops up to the Railway Bridge. there were a mixture of a Wireless Dealer, Drapers, Tobacconist, Watchmaker but my surprise find and i do remember the oval cream coloured sign of a Post Office which is No 318 L.G.Stairs Grocer & Post Office right next to the bridge and Five Bells Lane.
The other side of the Railway Bridge was No 316 Martin & Ellis Umbrella Makers in 1925 but only No 314 Earnest Gowers a Fruiterer... No 312 Holt Book Binder
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KeithG, I think I may have a picture of the church, I'll see if I can dig it out. I think I can also remember a shop called "Busy Bees", Chatham side of the railway bridge which sold knitting wool. No idea why I would remember that!
It's incredible the number and variety of shops there used to be from one end of the high street(s) to the other, pretty much unbroken from Rochester bridge through to Chatham Hill.
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Smiffy,Busy Bees allso sold rolls of material with pictures printed on them ,my sisters would stretch the material over a frame then stitich it with colord wools,(can't recall the name for it).
Moving back Rochester way,I remember Drakes a model air craft shop,later taken over by le core brothers,who incidently allso had a shop in Chatham ,brought my first kit from Drakes,Kiel Kraft three shillings and six pence.
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Colin... it is called "Embroidery".... My Father being in the Navy in Naples Italy during the war took up this as a hobby as did most men who got bored in dock.
He taught me how to stitch when my Mum had died I was just 11yrs and it kept me indoors instead of getting into trouble with other kids. I used to make chair back covers etc. with the coloured silks.
It was Lakes before Le Core but sounds like Drakes?
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Smiffy... Would be excellent to have a picture of the church.
I have downloaded a couple of Kelly's 1925 and Kent 1895 to try and picture the whole of the Banks through the different years.
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The only place I remember being along there in 1967 was The RAF Recruitment centre. An old friend of mine had a " home posting" & worked? there for 3 years., lived in Bearsted which was near enough home.
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Another internet find
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I thought a "then and now" or two might be interesting. This is the entrance to Nag's Head Lane, there is another view of this elsewhere on the forum showing the hairdresser and cafe from a different angle. Both are now demolished as can been seen in the lower view.
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If I remember rightly the last owner of the Cafe was Mr Mellor.
The family emigrated to Australia after compulsory purchase of the buildings. Was probably 1962/63 . The story with that ( and sorry if no one likes it ) the evening I met Bob he had been seeing Elaine Mellor who lived above the Cafe. Her Dad made her get home by 9pm even on a Friday night ! he took her home on his scooter came back to the Mountbatten club where we had all been , started talking to me and hey presto Magic , Elaine took it all in good part and wasn't bothered thankfully. The rest is history 50 odd yrs together.
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Lyn,of such stuff are our memories made,nice little story there,thanks for that.
KeithG thanks for jogging my memory,did you ever use the shop?there was a superb model of a Sunderland flying boat hanging from the shop cealling,pre plastic kit days so must have been hand made.
After Le-core brothers took over the shop became more railway orentated,then just became a general toy shop.think there was some sort of problem that led to the Chatham shop opening
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The St. Margarets Banks does have a lot to answer for :-X what with my parents Wedding Reception at the Hare & Hounds ...my girlfriend at the CCB shop and also yours Lyn at the Cafe.
Strange if Smiffy hadn`t started this thread all this stories would still be in the memories instead of being let out again?
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It's all history though and great memories of what used to be all along there. All the buildings associated with mine across Chatham and Rochester have been demolished and the church we married in now St Georges Centre.
Much prefer the older ones at least they lasted much longer than some we now have to put up with.
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Much prefer the older ones at least they lasted much longer than some we now have to put up with.
Do you mean the men or the churches? ;D ;)
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Not telling you Keith :-X :D
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Looks like the Chapel was already being used by Kent Art Printers when this was taken in the early 1960's.
The site is now occupied by the Microformat company and a used car dealership.
(https://i.postimg.cc/ZnphCFnM/Chapel.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)
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Really nice picture Smiffy... Kent Art Printers moved around quite a bit as they were in the Little Theatre building before they were. Also they were in another building near the Parlour at one time.
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The ground in front was once a burial ground, I wonder where the gravestones were moved to and did they also remove any remains?
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The parlour was behind the wall on the left of the pic surely. And KAP in the modern building behind it.
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In 1965 the KAP was No. 344 where Bishops Upholsterer was in 1925... The Hare & Hounds being No 340 and the Parlour No346
1n 1953 the KAP was No 256 which by 1965 was Medway Little Theatre.
So as you say Lyn and you also jogged my memory seeing KAP behind the Parlour so they were literally moving all the time?
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Are those the toilets in the wall, Keith? Just to the right.
DTT
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Dave... I believe those vents are there as the door is small and this was a Guest house above and this was the cellar for stock etc.... I have been in the cellar of the Sewing machine shop as that where my girlfriend in1964 lived, she didn't live in the cellar, and it was cool so an excellent storage space.
The toilets mentioned earlier were in the part of the Banks the Chatham side of the bridge, the vents were similar but smaller.
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Moving further along the Banks towards Star Hill needed a Google picture.
Left to right...No 324 Central Hotel 1953. Manor Press 1965......No322 Brigden Tobacconist 1953. Williams Tobacconist 1965
Left to right...No 320 Livingstone & Porter Signwriters 1965......No 318 L.G.Stairs Grocer & Post Office 1965 now a Micro Pub 2020
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This part of the banks seems to have remained pretty much intact. I'm not sure whether the building on the right is new or if it has been extensively rebuilt. The windows are in the same position and it's the same height - even the chimney appears to be in the same place. Look at the nice new Ford Anglia :)
(https://i.postimg.cc/DfXhjF6P/St-Margarets03.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)
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Smiffy...i have a problem?
In this picture around 1895 as in Kelly`s the name Spong is a Confectioner at No 298.......here is the big BUT the Kelly`s of 1895 is different to the later ones as it goes by names and then tells you where they live not by named roads then who lived at number whatever and so on.
My problem apart from that is the fact i want to know what shop is next to Spong No 296 with the lovely lights ...usually as you know they are pubs in that era but the Nags Head is next door but one?....i accept it could be another pub but i have to know the name who lives there to get the number in the 1895 Directory.
Any ideas??
By the way the buildings look as though they are rebuilt?
I found a Charles Vickrey lived at No 296 but doesn`t say what business?
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Usually Kellys is in 2 parts, by street & house and by people alphabetically
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Thanks for that Pete... I do have some Kelly's and they are as you say but the 1895 one of Kent you have to first get the Town and then know the name to get their address?
It covers all Kent with 1175 pages so you can imagine ?? ???
Have looked on the pubs site but no luck.... I don't really want to pay a subscription to ancestry >:(
Ah ha!.... Just found a list of Kent pubs on page 969 for All the Towns in Kent... I may be sometime
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I have a Herbert Jolley at 296 High street in 1903 - beer retailer. This means it was a beer house, not a licensed pub. Don't have a name for it though.
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Not normal for ale houses to have names , just known as Herberts etc. Ot but in my brewery days I had 1 ale house in my area, The Drum in Lavender Hill Tonbridge. Basically a 2 up 2 down knocked into one long room , tiny homemade counter in the corner and bitter stored out the back in what must have been the kitchen/scullery. They decided to go up market & I installed a Best Mild & Heineken under the bar. KeitG had a look on OS of that period 25"-mile, only shows NAGS head and another pub at the Rochester end just before the bank starts
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Thanks for helping.... It is the posh lights getting at me.
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Beer houses often had names in times gone by, they weren't marked on OS maps though, only licensed pubs had that honour. There is a Jolley listed as running the Three Cups in the Brook in the 1880's/90s, possibly a relative.
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Interesting as I found a Jolly in Brompton a Beer Retailer.
But thanks to you Smiffy I found in 1895 Charles Vickrey a Beer Retailer at 296 High Street... So it was still a Beer Retailer 8yrs before Jolley.
So that one solved ... I owe you a pint ;)
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Nice one Keith, I'll remember that!
I think this is what the forum should be all about though - personal memories combined with factual research. Chatham Intra as a whole is an interesting place - technically in Rochester, but in reality it seems to be in neither...
Methinks some time a Chatham Intra thread might be in order :)
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Great idea a Chatham Intra thread... But somehow I think maybe more difficult... still that is what makes it interesting.
I have been noticing about Strood older writings calling it Strood Intra?
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The Chatham Intra thread on the old forum was really interesting , such a lot of info was on there, hope it wasn't all lost.
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Lyn...
It is probably lost to those that matter! >:(
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I think I put a link to the basic history of Chatham Intra somewhere in GTP. If I can find it I'll copy it to a Chatham Intra thread. And I'm sure there are a few non copyrighted pics of the area to start off the thread. Bringing it up to date The Featherstone building has been turned into an artisan centre with central government money promised (pre-Covid) to help develop the area further.
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Along from the Nags Head before Le Core we have these two shops.
No 268 Maie Johnson Milliner and No 266 Mrs Woodcock Confectioner
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Just a question?...In 1895 the sign at the Nags Head was a Horses head which i understand as an old horse no good for work anymore.
In 1962 i have a picture of the Nags Head with no sign just a Courage & Barclay sign but now in 1990 a sign of a nagging woman?
Are signs allowed to be changed, does anyone know?
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I don't recall ever going to pub site meetings for redevelopment and there being an issue over the design changing, only the name. As long as it wasn't offensive anything went. Some different on each side like the Chatham Chest and the Billet Sittingbourne. Sign writing is a dying skill , and old signs were often copper sheets with the design punched in so repainting was basically painting by numbers. Modern materials and printing means almost anyone can produce a durable sign to any design. Whitbread had a sign painting shop at Pheonix Brewery Wateringbury, not sure when it closed but was't there in 1970s
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Where once was Henrie's there is now a yawning abyss:
(https://i.postimg.cc/pVhBGN4M/St-Margarets04.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/hhnxvYK2)
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I had completely forgotten Hugh Wyllies shop but oh those lovely fish and chips . Can't remember the last time I had any.
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This is my first post on this wonderfully interesting ForumI am particularly interested in the Banks as I lived there with my parents in the 50's and I am trying to match the House numbers of the High Street to the former Building Nos as St Margaret's Banks. Especially the Pubs as from Ancestry both my wife and I seem to have relatives who ran the same pubs!
Regarding the pic in this link. The doors are access for the cellars of the two properties (originally One Pub) above with a tunnel under the pavement.Thanks to KeithG for lots of info.nu Memory fascinates me, how quirky it can be. On the old forum a few years ago in "Guess the place", a member posted a photo of the double wooden doors, as seen in the brick wall. We emigrated to Australia from Rochester in 1980 and had not seen those doors since then, as a 24 years old. So after some 35 years they were instantly recognisable to me, just a set of wooden doors in a brick wall! I am sure that I would not recognise any other door from that time, for example even my own front door. I also seem to recall that some members posted about what was behind those doors.
Good to see that they are still there
https://www.google.com/maps/@51.3839428,0.5119508,3a,68.4y,219.25h,89.09t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1so8gBI6eHvHTkC9LK2rjBPw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656 (https://www.google.com/maps/@51.3839428,0.5119508,3a,68.4y,219.25h,89.09t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1so8gBI6eHvHTkC9LK2rjBPw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656)